Not that I have a Rose icon.

[schmerica]

So I've grasped for a while that the difference in my reactions to different seasons of Doctor Who seems to come from the fact that while Martha, with her awesomeness and winning of everything there is to win, owns my brain, Rose kind of owns my heart. And watching vids and thinking about the show today, it occurred to me part of exactly why that might be, which is actually kind of obvious, in just that -- Rose needs the Doctor in a way that Martha never could. Martha has a life and a job and a future and a family and a purpose, and all that stuff makes her her own independent and confident person. It's something that she has, no matter what happens with the Doctor. Whereas Rose ... Rose doesn't have all of that, in the same way, so after she's seen the Tardis and the universe, no wonder she latches on, decides that this has to be the rest of her life; it's that scene in "Parting of the Ways" in the restaurant, contemplating her life of bus rides and chips. So it's no wonder Martha can say enough and walk away, while Rose would never be able to.

(The Doctor is AUTOMATICALLY the most important person in Rose's life, and always will be. That's the kind of relationship I find most interesting, especially because she's the most important to him, too, then. It's, of course, much more healthy for Martha that she isn't in that situation, and not only because the Doctor can't give her that. Martha is a kick-ass character and I love her madly, but I think that's why she doesn't clutch at my heart the way Rose does, why I don't feel for her as much.)

Comments

[petronelle.livejournal.com]

This creeps me out deeply and makes perfect sense.

Oh, Rose. (Of whom I rather need an icon.)

[pearl-o.livejournal.com]

I can see all the ways it's creepy, but at the same time... I don't know, in the same way that it would have been so unhealthy for Martha, I think the crazy codependency in Rose's relationship with the Doctor is still good for her, in a way. I mean, the fact that she did have that need means that she gained so, so much from being with him, I guess? I don't know, there's something about the way that Rose and the Doctor are fulfilling this really important role for each other that makes me all weaky and gooshy and squeaky inside.

[phineasjones.livejournal.com]

yeah. yeah, exactly. i mean, i'll never know how i would feel about martha not in relation to rose. because she came after rose and, man, that really sucks for her. but all the reasons she's awesome are also the reasons she'd be ok without the doctor. and i do believe that rose will be some kind of ok too (i have to believe that) but... she will never be complete. as you say, he is automatically the most important person in her life. and the way that connected them was... beautiful, really. sigh. rose.

there are some rose icons here (http://phineasjones.livejournal.com/955969.html#cutid1) that you're welcome to, if you're in the market.

[pearl-o.livejournal.com]

The thing is that I really *do* love Martha, so very much; like, the amount of love I have would probably easily make her my favorite person on almost any other show. And when I'm watching s3, I'm all caught up in the love.

But then I watch s1 or s2, or look at picture, or even just think about it again, and it's just .... ROOOOOOOOSE.

[hobbledehoy.livejournal.com]

i haven't actually seen any of the season(s?) with martha yet, except for herecomethedrumsherecomethedrums, so i am a little behind, but your thoughts on rose and tehdr's relationship are prety much what i've been seeing from it too, *especially* because of stuff with mickey (when i saw the first episode on tv i was really sad because ohshit what about her and mickey), first leaving him and them him coming along... and once he was gone i guess it was kind of all settled, her slightly codependent relationship with the doctor.

[pearl-o.livejournal.com]

The season with Martha is a lot of fun! It's a little slow in the middle, but the last half or so is awesomesauce.

My sister has the same "aw, poor mickey!" and lots of sympathy for him, but, um, I always found him kind of annoying. Hm.

[hobbledehoy.livejournal.com]

i also kind of find him kind of annoying, but i also find rose kind of annoying, and you have to admit they're a very cute couple.

[utterfrivolity.livejournal.com]

As might be obvious from the fact that I use Rose icons at least 90% of the time, I love her so, so much. I love Martha as well--from her first episode she completely kicked ass, and was the perfect follow-up to Rose in what a fantastic contrast she provided to Rose's characteristics, good and bad--but Rose is one of my favorite female characters of all time, right alongside CJ from The West Wing and Tracy from The Philadelphia Story (and Bao-chai from Hong Lou Meng, but unfortunately that story doesn't get much play in the English-speaking world).

And at first I had trouble explaining why I was so desperately in love with this character, as on the surface she is nothing like my other heroines, who are outwardly very strong and independent and worldly. But I think that the reason I've always loved any of these characters is that they're not as cool and collected as they appear to be. They're lonely and scared and confused, but they've conditioned themselves not to show these emotions. I love them because they are strong women, and intelligent and successful, but that doesn't mean that they don't want to break down in tears more often than anyone around them will ever know. Easy to relate to that.

But then Rose...she's young and naive and she hasn't learned yet how not to give her heart away, how to hide what she thinks and feels, or even try to do so most of the time. She giggles and glares and pouts and weeps and the great thing about this show is, the Doctor appreciates all that, and gets that none of that makes her less strong a person. Seeing Rose and the Doctor be so unreservedly happy with each other and develop a relationship of mutual love and respect makes me so happy, because that's the way I wish the world were. I wish that girls could be girls and not be considered stupid or weak for it (and I don't mean to restrict this to one gender, and I'm definitely over-generalizing, but I do think that the burden of hiding certain types of emotions falls disproportionately on women, and that we need more characters like Rose to counter the social assumptions at the source of this problem).

Sorry for writing so much! Comment got away from me there. I was overcome with love, I guess, but now that it's written, I might as well post it. In conclusion, yay Rose!

[pearl-o.livejournal.com]

Dude, don't be sorry for writing so much at all! I'm lame and don't have an adequate response to comment back with, but I loved reading your thoughts; it was really fascinating. And yes: yay Rose!