nothing i say in here is a complaint, if that's not clear. i like you just the way you are, bandom.

[schmerica]

So there was a comment the other day basically saying "The reason some OTPs are written so much more than others is because there's more stuff to play with" -- which may well be true! But then it went on to say "If the other pairing did more canon stuff, more people would write that instead!" -- which I think is definitely NOT true, because it doesn't take into account the fact that Pairing A and Pairing B can do the exact same thing, and it's only the pairing that's already your OTP that's going to make you go "EEEE MORE CANON FOR SHIPPING."

Which is to say, even if Bob and Frank suddenly started being way more gay in public, it is not going to make a Frank/Gerard person switch over. REALLY GAY AND AWESOME CANON when it's your pairing = cute boys being friends with each other when it's not your pairing. Fact of life! I just read an interview where Mikey Way mentions getting an email from Pete Wentz, and my response was OMIGOD THEY'RE SO IN LOVE EEEEEEEEEEEE. Rationality has nothing to do with it.

(And thinking about it, who I actually feel sorry for are the Frank/Mikey shippers. There will never be any sort of canon for you that will not just make people go "Awww, look how much he likes his brother-in-law! That's so sweet.")

I was actually rereading a fuckload of Pete/Mikey stories today, because someone I love was asking for recs, and it was actually kind of depressing. People talk about them a lot more than they write them! And a lot of the stories tagged on del.icio.us with "pete/mikey" are really random Summer of Like stories that happen to have the two of them making out vaguely somewhere in the background. Also, I don't know, I feel like my preferences in regard to them tend to be kind of different from bandom as a whole. Like, I don't really get the EPIC TRAGEDY OH NOOOOOOOES vibe from them at all. Where are people getting evidence that they parted at the end of the summer anything but really good friends? Pete wearing his Mikey button was fall 2005, all the pictures/buzznet entries about old friends/away messages/myspaces things defending pete's nudity/etc are from early 2006. The HeyChris thing didn't actually have anything to do with Pete at all. Mikey was still mentioning Pete in interviews after The Black Parade came out. I'm pretty sure there was a FOB interview last year where Pete got asked about the last text message he'd received, and it was Mikeyway asking what was up.

I mean, it's possible I just missed something, but, uh. It seems like it would be a pretty big thing to miss.

Also, it's not like it matters. Anything even vaguely connected with Pete/Mikey I swallow up like candy and love you forever.

Anyway. It is past six pm already. This apparently happens when you sleep in all day. Now I have to decide if it is still worth walking down to the grocery store!

Comments

[impertinence.livejournal.com]

Being a rarepair fan is weird! You learn how to squee over, I don't know, two lines of fic.

And yeah, I don't think Pete and Mikey are really a huge tragedy. They stayed friends!

[pearl-o.livejournal.com]

Ahaha, it is like how me and Claire were saying in your journal last night how our Ray/Gerard desire is so all-encompassing largely because there's SO LITTLE. If people put more random BFF stuff in all the time, I would probably be shipping them even less, because I would be satisfied with their love for each other.

[restless-jedi.livejournal.com]

It's true, people don't write Pete/Mikey near enough. And when they do, it's not happy fic often enough. Regardless of the canon on how they may or may not have parted (I figure there was a time of silence between them before they could be friends again, because that is usually how things work), the canon from during the summer says they were happy. They were happy and having a good time.

*sigh*

[pearl-o.livejournal.com]

See, I feel bad saying "bandom doesn't do enough of THIS" because I really do believe that people should just write what makes them happy, you know? And if they don't feel like writing about my dudes, that's their loss. I'll just have to post about their awesomeness even more.

[jezrana.livejournal.com]

Anonymeme confession: The last post in this thread (http://bandomanon.livejournal.com/675.html?thread=528547#t528547) is mine, and I was just waiting for someone to comment with "yeah, but that's just Frank being playful! FRIENDS!" Which, okay, if there was footage of Frank trying to drag Gerard into bed, shippers would have a field day with it.

I'm the same way with not really getting the "falling-out of doooooooom!!" vibe with Pete and Mikey. Handholdy starry-eyed crushes can just die out on their own and leave a friendship intact.

[pearl-o.livejournal.com]

Ahahahah, ADMISSION TIME: the person you were directly replying to was me. :D

I don't know, there's always plenty of things to squee over if you're inclined to squee over them, if you know what I mean? Some OTPs have more stuff you can point to, is all.

[riflethrough.livejournal.com]

Hi!

You feel sorry for me? I feel sorry for me, too! I really love Frank/Mikey, but since it isn't often written, if at all, I usually default to lovin' on Frank/Bob.

And, I don't mind reading those EPIC TRAGEDY fics where it's just completely NOT POSSIBLE for Mikey and Pete to stay together and participate in a long distance relationship, but. I'd also really love a story where they were just really good friends that liked to make out every now and then, and maybe Pete asks Mikey for relationship advice sometimes? Heh, I don't know.

[pearl-o.livejournal.com]

I guess part of it might just be that I don't think break-ups are necessarily, you know, that horrible? I don't know! Like I said, I'm a sucker for them any which way.

It always seems odd that there isn't more Frank/Mikey fic, considering everything together! The Gerard thing is the only explanation I can come up with.

[warmingweather.livejournal.com]

I don't like endings, so the combination of the end of the Summer of Like and the end of Pete and Mikey's relationwhatever makes me sadface, even if they parted on good terms. Plus, since from what I understand Pete provided more of the canon through his blogs and namedrops than Mikey did, I think some people tend to assume that Pete was more invested in it than Mikey was, regardless of how true that was. And bandom is nothing if not concerned with Pete's happiness. :D

[pearl-o.livejournal.com]

*grins* OVERINVESTMENT IN PETE WENTZ'S HAPPINESS SHOULD BE REQUIREMENT NUMBER ONE TO GET IN THE DOOR, FOR SERIOUS.

[sharpest_rose.livejournal.com]

From that Mikey interview: Actually, Gerard's single now. So, in theory, he would get all the chicks. He's not really into that, though.

Just wanted to quote that again.

[pearl-o.livejournal.com]

ahahahahhaaha OH GOD. I didn't even notice that my first time through. <3<3<3

[gigantic.livejournal.com]

I don't think Pete/Mikey is the kind of pairing that should make you want to go lie down in traffic or anything, but I have always kind of seen them as bittersweet? They're friends, but they aren't together, and then Pete makes posts about waiting in hotels for something he knows isn't going to happen or posts like these shortly after the Summer, and then there's "Bang The Doldrums." Maybe it's all actually about Jeanae, whatever, but for purposes of writing and weaving things around canon timelines, it's always made me imagine them (as a pairing) being sort of bittersweet, yeah.

[pearl-o.livejournal.com]

*nods* I think that makes sense! I definitely don't think there's really a ton of room for happy fluffiness or an actual relationship between them? Possibly the time in the fandom where I came in made means I'm just likely to go "aw, but they're still buddies, even though they're ex-boyfriends!" as much as "EX-BOYFRIENDS :((((". I don't know.

[queenofhell.livejournal.com]

Actually, I totally read the HeyChris/Mikey thing as a HUGE canon support for Pete/Mikey--I'll be honest, it totally made me put my tinhat on and BELIEVE that something actually happened between Pete and Mikey. Like, Chris' wanky posts have totally affected my view of Pete/Mikey because I think he was mocking what actually happened: Pete decided that he could maybe be a little gay for Mikey and went all over the top romantic about it, but couldn't follow through on the physical stuff so it fell apart. Mikey totally didn't take it that seriously since it was just a fling and non-physical, which is why he did the photo shoot with Chris and yet still defended Pete, while Pete totally took the whole thing seriously which is why his away message was "I hate the world" or something after the Mikey/Chris pictures debuted. Like, Pete knew he was being mocked for something he took really really seriously, but to Mikey it wasn't a big deal.

See? Tinhat. What this fandom does to me, I swear to god.

[lovesongwriter.livejournal.com]

Too bad the HeyChris thing wasn't even about Pete. I mean, HeyChris even told everyone what it was about.

[besquared.livejournal.com]

oh god. i'm probably not a person who should be responding to this (seeing as i've written my own [to borrow ceej's word] bittersweet version of the end of their relationship (http://unprolific.livejournal.com/6837.html#cutid1)), but the general tone of interviews, blogs, etc, has given me the impression that things ended not so well between those kwazy kidz. i can't speak much further than that without sounding like an irrational tinhat who reads waaaaaay too much into said interviews, blogs, heychris posting pictures to make pete jealous, et cet. whether or not pete and mikey were romantically involved-- there's no knowing, because a) we don't know these people, and b) this was a friendship that pete, for whatever reason, wanted to keep under his ugly hat. i will speak generally and say that i think the very nature of intense friendships is that they're even harder to fall out of than romantic entanglements. and i for one would like to read more stories about what it was like for them to lose each other as best friends, not lovers.

also, i'd like to read sappy future-fic. because i'm ridiculous like that. :)))))))))

[pearl-o.livejournal.com]

Dude, I didn't mean to sound like I was criticizing; I think bittersweet is a totally valid take on them, you know? And so EPIC TRAGEDY is too, but it's weird when you read a whole lot of fic at once and that seems to be the overriding tone, I guess. Also, possibly the funniest comment I read on the anon meme yesterday was blasting happy Pete/Mikey because it is impossible, because "the beauty of the relationship was in the disaster." Hee.

(Also, the number one reason I have heard from people for why they're not into Pete/Mikey is that is makes them too sad, and I always find that funny.)

I would totally read more futurefic about them, though. They've both grown up some since then.

[lovesongwriter.livejournal.com]

I think they probably had a falling out at the end of the summer.

With ya know, the fact Pete cheated on Alicia, broke up with her, cheated on Jeanae, then rumored to have slept with Jac Vanek and Kate from The Fight.

I think people forget the hundred different things Pete was doing in the summer besides Mikey. That Warped he was rumored to be with A LOT of girls.

I think even if they were friends, Mikey was friends with Alicia as well. Then it all kinda went to hell.

I think they only started talking when, you know, Mikey realized Pete is Pete. And he's not gonna change and he isn't healthy for Mikey. Mikey on his own isn't healthy, but Pete is a fucking cargo bay of baggage.

[pearl-o.livejournal.com]

I am intrigued by your theory!

Sometimes it is hard to keep track of just how incredibly fucked up Pete Wentz is, man.

[olivia-circe.livejournal.com]

So I always really like everything you say about Pete/Mikey, but it keeps making me think in New and Different Ways, which is a little dangerous (um, in a good way) when I am in the middle of writing a fairly substantial Pete/Mikey/Alicia post-Summer of Like story. Keep it up and I'm going to have to credit you for inspiration or something. \o/?

One of the things I fell hardest for first, in bandom, was the enormity of the cast of characters and the sheer number of pairing options. Sure, there are pairings that I get more excited about, but there is just so much awesome that I can never get bored, like, ever. Which is to say that any canon, however interpreted, really just adds to the fun, I think.

[pearl-o.livejournal.com]

Pete/Mikey/Alicia = my ot3 yay! I encourage this very highly.

I think of Pete/Mikey as my otp, but I just mean it's my favorite pairings. The two major fandoms I was in before bandom were Smallville and Due South, and they were really both fandoms where there was one main pairing we all kept coming back to, you know? This is a whole different situation for me.

[foxxcub.livejournal.com]

REALLY GAY AND AWESOME CANON when it's your pairing = cute boys being friends with each other when it's not your pairing.

TRUER WORDS WERE NEVER SPOKEN.

[pearl-o.livejournal.com]

\o/

The very best is like with the Mikey/Frank example up there, though. When you can interpret one half of your pairing being GAY AND LOVING with another dude, and you can still twist it to support your otp? YOU KNOW YOU HAVE IT BAD.

[shihadchick.livejournal.com]

I mostly just wanted to add a giant WORD! to your first paragraph in particular because- yes. SO true. And completely applicable to, like, almost every fandom ever as well, I think. Which I think people do tend to forget occasionally. Like... just because person X loves pairing/trope Y doesn't mean that they love pairing/trope Z any less, or that if Y didn't exist they would automatically love Z more! I have run headfirst into that assumption way too often in the last couple of years, and I think you put it well in terms of how the same action can be viewed in both sort of angles.

And more happier Pete/Mikey would totally be shiny, too, I think. *leans towards your angle of view there quite markedly, as a matter of fact* Just- it seems like *tin hat welded firmly to head, obv* it would've maybe been hard or uncomfortable and all that kind of thing, and the ways a friendship sort of adjusts after you stop being the kind of friends who make out sometimes can be a bit odd/quiet at first (um. not that i would know. much. heh.) but I've never really got the huge greek tragedy vibe from it myself. Admittedly, I've still tin-hat-ily interpreted looked at a lot less canon than other people most likely have (because MCR in general and Panic made with the eating of my life, and I guess that 'work' thing probably came in there, too ;) ), but... yeah.

[pearl-o.livejournal.com]

I don't know, Pete and Mikey being friends long after whatever would have happened happened is kind of my favorite thing about them, in some ways. But I am even tinhattier than you, so!

[ubixtiz.livejournal.com]

And thinking about it, who I actually feel sorry for are the Frank/Mikey shippers. There will never be any sort of canon for you that will not just make people go "Awww, look how much he likes his brother-in-law! That's so sweet."

You realise that saying this makes it more likely there will be evidence now, right? *waits for Mikey/Alicia/Frank threesome sex tape to surface*

[pearl-o.livejournal.com]

They lived together! Frank just wore a Mikeyway t-shirt! He called him eight million times a day during his hiatus! I WELCOME WHATEVER ELSE THEY CAN BRING TO THE CAUSE.

[spvinter.livejournal.com]

Amen. Although canon kissing is always fun, a person's OTP has very little to do with the amount of canonical evidence that can be found.

I have to agree with you on the Pete/Mikey issue as well. Romantic relationship or not, if it ended badly or not, the guys obviously remained friends after The Summer of Like and, as far as we can tell, are still pretty good friends. Whatever happened between those two might have been sad or bittersweet at the time, but I can't really see the epic tragedy in it.

If people really want to talk about sad, look at the friendships between MCR and The Used and that blow out. Seriously, Pete/Mike have nothing on that shitfest.

[pearl-o.livejournal.com]

Only recently have I accepted the Gerard/Bert love. It makes me go like this DDDDDD: all the time.

[blushandrecover.livejournal.com]

Just wanted to say, about this:
(And thinking about it, who I actually feel sorry for are the Frank/Mikey shippers. There will never be any sort of canon for you that will not just make people go "Awww, look how much he likes his brother-in-law! That's so sweet.")

Yeah, we know. It's really disheartening.

About Mikey/Pete, when I first got into this Bandom Thing (a little more than a year ago, maybe a year and half), the way people always talked about those two was with "sad" and "over" implied. I think it's really dented/tainted my view of the pairing now, too. I came in assuming they were "so over" and it was "tragic" and whatnot, but I'm betting you're right. Except for the one interview that you linked, I haven't seen a lot since '06, though. There's an interview with Frank (from New Zealand, I think) where they ask if Pete Wentz was on tour with them(since some other guy named Pete drummed for them). Frank gets oddly quiet and answers pretty quickly in the negative.

Then again, that's me trying to read more into it than there is, because that gives me fodder for Frank being overprotective of Mikey. It's all so ridiculous, really.

Yikes - I really didn't mean to go all tl;dr on you, but it's my day off and I'm bored.

[withafireinside.livejournal.com]

(And thinking about it, who I actually feel sorry for are the Frank/Mikey shippers. There will never be any sort of canon for you that will not just make people go "Awww, look how much he likes his brother-in-law! That's so sweet.")

That would *so* be my reaction. *lol* Breaking up my OTP always bums me out. Even if Frank/Mikey would be so easy to ship otherwise.

When I get into a fandom, I'm usually influenced by the canon more than the fanon, but the reverse is true with bandom. I think it's because, ironically, fictional canons are more concrete to me than all the real life events and occurrences that we call "canon" in RPS.

I mostly read Frank/Gerard because that's the first pairing I read, and it got stuck in my mind as the default. And I kinda love that even in gen-ish fics, Frank/Gerard is often treated as canon, simply because it seems to be so ingrained in fanon. I know it's incredibly frustrating for people who ship other pairings and want more fics about them. But pointing out canon often does seem kinda useless to me because fanon > canon in the case of bandslash, and like you said, often the most important canon is the canon that supports your OTP.

Ugh, I spent a lot of time editing this reply. I hope it at least makes a little bit of sense.

[lucentvictrola.livejournal.com]

Yeah, it's kind of sad being a rarepair fan. Most of my favorite pairings involve largely unwritten people, like Tom Conrad, Greta Salpeter, Katie Kay, Dusty, Amanda Palmer, etc. My het OTP is Tom/Greta, in fact, but I only extremely rarely see it, since there's nothing to connect them at all.

I guess that's the good thing about liking every pairing more-or-less equally. There are a few that go above-and-beyond, and some characters that I squee over any time I see them, but I'll read anything (just usually not Brendon/Ryan; it bores me unless it's really well-written).